Portable Celestia?

[alooper21]

ok, call me dumb if it sounds like. today i posted something about sounds in celestia and someone replyed that i didn't searched for this subject, something was done in that direction. well, now i tried tot do my homework first so i won't ask stupid questions (tough i didn't asked google yet:P). so, what i want to know is: did anybody tought about porting celestia to PSP? wich stands for PlayStation Portable, ok, not Paint Shop Pro! it shoudn't be difficult, nor impossible,since quake 1 was ported to psp, for example, and it works like a charm. i gave this example to show that porting 3d aplications can be done, not only zelda and bomberman. i saw that some posts about celestia on ps3 linux are here, developers don't give too many chances to that, or at least don't bother, mostly because of the controllers, but on psp it shoud be easy to find a controling model to suit the butons layout. the analog stick can be used for up/down, left/right, the cross can be forward and the square backward, the shoulder buttons can lean (or spin) the view left and right. triangle button opens the menu for the selected object and the digital pad navigates trougt it. the menus in the menu bar apear when the start button is pushed, and from there several settings can be reached with the digital pad. in most of cases the selection of items can be done automatically with the digital pad, like pushing the tab/shift-tab in windows.

i know this is not as easy as it might be understand from here, but i have a feeling that is not as hard as porting to other platforms. and i sai that because: i have the example of quake 1 and lately even quake 2 (multiplayer only) anf, finally, the lua coding, wich i see is "understood" by both celestia and psp.

so, what do you think?

[ANDREA]

ok, call me dumb if it sounds like. today i posted something about sounds in celestia and someone replyed that i didn't searched for this subject, something was done in that direction. well, now i tried tot do my homework first so i won't ask stupid questions (tough i didn't asked google yet:P). so, what i want to know is: did anybody tought about porting celestia to PSP? wich stands for PlayStation Portable....so, what do you think?

alooper21, I'm the same "someone" who replied to your previous post on "Sounds" and, curiously, Andrea is my true name, not a nickname like your one (BTW, please, there is no need for so many thanks for my reply!).
I'm sorry to inform you that the title you used for this topic is not only wrong (portable means "a light and portable version of a software"), but that another thread has already been submitted on Mar 22, 2006 in the Celestia Users Forum, with the same "portable celestia" title.
Obviously that thread was correctly speaking on how to have Celestia installed on a memory stick, so to have the possibility to use it on any PC.
I repeat my previous suggestion:
before posting new threads check with the "Search" possibility you have on top of any message.
Bye

Andrea

[julesstoop]

Yeah. It should be called 'pocket Celestia', or whatever.

With the all these different devices with proprietary OS's around, it will take some time before this idea is viable. I'm sure though that the PSP or the iPhone have ample processing power to run some simplified version of Celestia.

As it is now though, Celestia is developed using OpenGL for the graphics rendering a.f.a.i.k. OpenGL is not supported on any of these devices (unless they run some form of Linux)/

[Kolano]

Yeah. It should be called 'pocket Celestia', or whatever.

I'd associate that with a version of Celestia that ran on Pocket PCs. I think a better title would probably have been something in direct alignment with the topic "Celestia on PSP", but that is neither here nor there and also irrelevent to the topic.

To answer the question of the post...

I know of no active effort to port Celestia to the PSP and I don't believe that porting Celestia to such platforms is on the current development roadmap. I'm also guessing that most of the current developers have minimal to no experience with that platform.

Generally, a few essential underlying technologies would likely need to be supported before anyone would even attempt to do so. OpenGL for one. Since, as you indicate Quake is supported by PSP, and I believe that Quake is an OpenGL based program a port may be more easily possible. I imagine the lack of inputs would also pose a problem for such a port, as Celestia current uses almost every keyboard button for something.

Celestia is open source software though, so if you'd like to get some PSP developers interested in porting Celestia you should feel free to sent them over to the code on Sourceforge, or to this forum.

[alooper21]

alooper21, I'm the same "someone" who replied to your previous post on "Sounds" and, curiously, Andrea is my true name, not a nickname like your one (BTW, please, there is no need for so many thanks for my reply!).
I'm sorry to inform you that the title you used for this topic is not only wrong (portable means "a light and portable version of a software"), but that another thread has already been submitted on Mar 22, 2006 in the Celestia Users Forum, with the same "portable celestia" title.
Obviously that thread was correctly speaking on how to have Celestia installed on a memory stick, so to have the possibility to use it on any PC.
I repeat my previous suggestion:
before posting new threads check with the "Search" possibility you have on top of any message.
Bye

Andrea

ok, dear andreea, i feel a bit annoied: i'm sure the subject of the post comes out very clear from what i said, so i doubt you didn't understood what i want to know. but instead of giving some straight answers to the questions behind the lines, yot got stuck on superficial details. if you were bothered about not writing a thank you fot the answer on another post of mine, well, it coud be your problem. i anounce you now that i was pleased with it, i am now enjoying a nice audio enviroment while traveling to stars and all. it woud be no problem to say something about the title of the post if after that you treat the subject of the post with something else than "search first". as i mentioned, i searched before, but just because i searched for psp and playstation instead of portable doesn't mean that i didn't searched at all.

as a final word: you sound like you are a bit too full of themselves. not all the users of celestia have who knows what kind of fine studies and some high-tech language.

EDIT

let me show you an example of a good answer, even if these are not the kind of requested details, but is what i really like, because is on subject. the answer was given in a pm on another forum:

It's quite difficult to tell sometimes if something will be easy or hard to port to PSP.

The big issue on the PSP is memory. PCs have loads of it, and a swap file for when memory runs out. The PSP has 24 MiB free (the OS uses 8 ) for user programs. It has no swap file or MMU, so running out of memory or memory becoming too fragmented to allocate from is always a threat for memory hungry programs.

This is why Quake 2 is so crippled compared to the PC version.

I had a quick look using Task Manager, and Celestia seems to use about 75 MiB while running. Some of that is probably down to texture data (which the driver may have multiple copies of), but realistically it has to be cut down to 24 MiB or less before it's possible on PSP.

If most of the memory is used by simulation data (which may be difficult to reduce in quality or size), porting will be difficult.

Pete

[LordFerret]

you sound like you are a bit too full of themselves.

Wow. Rude! I don't think you could be more wrong about Andrea. Perhaps it's not to your liking, but his advice was sound, as was the direction he pointed you in.

[alooper21]

you sound like you are a bit too full of themselves.

Wow. Rude! I don't think you could be more wrong about Andrea. Perhaps it's not to your liking, but his advice was sound, as was the direction he pointed you in.

excuse me, mylord, but am i wrong or you simply are not onto subject the subject of the topic? and you simply didn't understod my answer. i wasn't rude, i just gave the right answer to how andrea gave her own to the post. and andrea cannot be "not to my liking", since i don't know her, so i can't be wrong.

so, what do you say, woud you like celestia on your gameboy?

[ANDREA]

--- i wasn't rude, i just gave the right answer to how andrea gave her own to the post. and andrea cannot be "not to my liking", since i don't know her, so i can't be wrong.

Sure you don't know me, because I'm a "him", not a "her".

so, what do you say, woud you like celestia on your gameboy?

For what regards me, ABSOLUTELY NO!!!
Bye

Andrea

[LordFerret]

so, what do you say, woud you like celestia on your gameboy?

I'm sorry but I can't see the purpose of putting Celestia on a Gameboy... Celestia isn't a game. The only thing I could envision aside from a pc, would be a laptop or palmtop where it could be used 'out in the field' (for far more constructive purposes).

[t00fri]

Celestia on a gameboy??...Bad company!
Then even more teenagers would be requesting laser guns for Celestia

Bye Fridger

[selden]

Many people seem to enjoy the challange of converting game machines into general purpose computers. I can imagine circumstances when having Celestia, or something similar, in a pocket sized device would be convenient.

[t00fri]

Many people seem to enjoy the challange of converting game machines into general purpose computers. I can imagine circumstances when having Celestia, or something similar, in a pocket sized device would be convenient.

Yes, but would YOU buy a gameboy?

Bye Fridger

[ElChristou]

Oh yes, I'd like to see Celestia on the GameBoy first edition.... (black & white 3 pixels screen!)

More seriously, I still don't understand why people want to browse internet or else via a cellphone or other pocket device... Even on the iPhone, things are better but...
Ok I understand some specific apps such maps, weather or stocks, but browsing the web or playing a game made for normal screen, really...

[alooper21]

You, people, are totally off the record! damn, i just can't stop loughing
I WAS IRONICAL WHEN I SAID ABOUT THE GAMEBOY! i mean i just wanted to show somehow how much you miss the point of a post just because you pay too much attention to the "politics of posting". WTF!!!

Celestia is not for a portable console because is not a game? "Oh, crap, sonny, might as well just leave this to me?" Since when portable consoles are not aloud to run educational software? how about calling children to celestia, and therefore to education, trough psp, and not to cs, or wow or gta and any other shit? is about reaching new grounds in the first place, anyway, like in a real market!

[Fenerit]

alooper21, your language expression is not properly for children...

[t00fri]

You, people, are totally off the record! damn, i just can't stop loughing

Perhaps, the "misunderstanding" is due to your English?

More seriously, Celestia is really VERY demanding for any OpenGL driver, since many extensions etc are exploited!

So if you want a technical answer, it's up to you to tell us FIRST concisely about the status of OpenGL drivers in such game machines. What OpenGL version is typically offered if any? Pure DirectX systems are out of the question, of course.

As was said before, no one of us developers seems to have significant experience with such game devices. Why the hell should we? . But note: you are free to invest all YOUR time in this task, since Celestia is OpenSource.

In view of the many time consuming coding projects that are ahead of us and WELL motivated, I doubt that a request for porting Celestia to e.g. a gameboy would ever make it high up on our todo list.

Sorry, but I have many other reasons for investing my time into Celestia's development than getting children off playing games on a gameboy or similar.
It's first of all the parent's duty to take care of what their children do, not that of the Celestia team...

Bye Fridger

[ElChristou]

...how about calling children to celestia, and therefore to education, trough psp, and not to cs, or wow or gta and any other shit? is about reaching new grounds in the first place, anyway, like in a real market!

Mmhh... not sure those young souls will choose Celestia to play with when there is tons of much, but much more attractive games over there (those with laser guns, with big BAOUM and other StarWars like effects...)...

I suppose a higher priority about "new grounds" would be to promote Celestia in Universities and others educative establishments...

[LordFerret]

I can imagine circumstances when having Celestia, or something similar, in a pocket sized device would be convenient.

Yes, that was my thought, as many of these small devices have an interface to screen projection units (handy for presentations).

I suppose a higher priority about "new grounds" would be to promote Celestia in Universities and others educative establishments...

YES! Infinitely more important than a port over to Gameboy! Make getting the kids OFF Gameboy the priority.

[BlindedByTheLight]

Perhaps, the "misunderstanding" is due to your English?

Now THAT was worth the price of admission.