When selecting fuzzy points or scaled discs stars dissapear

[duds26]

On my home computer:
When selecting fuzzy points or scaled discs stars dissapear.

Have Windows Vista Home Premium (checked for updates)
ATI x1600 latest updates
Celestia 1.5.0Final

This is a problem off the Software (ATI drivers in windows and Mac).
That don't provide point sprit support anymore.
But instead geometrie shading could be used.
Chris this is something for known issues.

The Nvidia drivers of my laptop work without a problem.
All the star rendering modes are displayed fine there.

[t00fri]

When selecting fuzzy points or scaled discs stars dissapear.

Have Windows Vista Home Premium (checked for updates)
ATI x1600 latest updates
Celestia 1.5.0pre6

I checked this under Linux and cannot confirm your claim. So it's certainly NOT due to the code. Perhaps Vista is playing games on you, but that's not Celestia's problem.

F.

[chris]

Is anyone else seeing this bug? DW added a workaround for point sprite problems with ATI hardware, but it only affects Macs.

--Chris

[Hungry4info]

I am unable to replicate this on pre6 or pre5.

[BobHegwood]

This is definitely NOT a Vista problem...

Just checked on my system, and looks fine. Just FYI.

Have you checked for firmware updates, THEN Windows Vista
updates? Also, having selected fuzzy stars, have you used the
] key to increase the visible magnitudes? I have mine set to the
maximum, and that may also be your problem.

Once you start Celestia, simply tap the right bracket key "]" about
20 times to increase the visible magnitude of the stars.

Works fine on my machine. See details in signature.

Thanks, Brain-Dead

[Astrojockel]

I have the same problem. If i select scaled disk or fuzzy Points, the stars dissapear at a distance >1 Lj.

I think, the Problem ist the new ATI 8.1 driver. Before there was no problem.

System: ATI x1950pro @ ATI 8.1 without CCC @ WinXP SP2

By this i found, that a handfull stars (HIP 65421, HIP 93784, HIP 65731 and few more, all >900 Lj distance) are still visible with the problem, but dissapear, if Galaxys are deselected in display options.

[chris]

I have the same problem. If i select scaled disk or fuzzy Points, the stars dissapear at a distance >1 Lj.

I think, the Problem ist the new ATI 8.1 driver. Before there was no problem.

System: ATI x1950pro @ ATI 8.1 without CCC @ WinXP SP2

By this i found, that a handfull stars (HIP 65421, HIP 93784, HIP 65731 and few more, all >900 Lj distance) are still visible with the problem, but dissapear, if Galaxys are deselected in display options.

Thanks for the bug report. Which version of Celestia are you using? I'm trying to figure out whether this is something new in pre6 or if it's an ATI driver problem that affects all 1.5.0 versions.

--Chris

[Astrojockel]

Hi Chris,

i tested a little more. My results under XPpro SP2@Ati x1950pro:
- 1.5.0pre4 and pre6 with Ati 7.12 works fine.
- 1.5.0pre4 and pre6 with Ati 8.1 produce the error under OpenGL 2.0 and OpenGL vertex program. Basic und Multitexture works fine!

I hope, this is helpfull.

Here some mor Informations:

Code: Select all


Anbieter: ATI Technologies Inc.

Renderer: Radeon X1950 Pro

Version: 2.1.7275 Release

GLSL-Version: 1.20

Maximale Anzahl simultaner Texturen: 8

Maximale Texturgr?¶??e: 4096

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GL_EXT_compiled_vertex_array

GL_EXT_copy_texture

GL_EXT_draw_range_elements

GL_EXT_fog_coord

GL_EXT_framebuffer_object

GL_EXT_gpu_program_parameters

GL_EXT_multi_draw_arrays

GL_EXT_packed_depth_stencil

GL_EXT_packed_pixels

GL_EXT_point_parameters

GL_EXT_rescale_normal

GL_EXT_secondary_color

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GL_EXT_stencil_wrap

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GL_EXT_texgen_reflection

GL_EXT_texture3D

GL_EXT_texture_compression_s3tc

GL_EXT_texture_cube_map

GL_EXT_texture_edge_clamp

GL_EXT_texture_env_add

GL_EXT_texture_env_combine

GL_EXT_texture_env_dot3

GL_EXT_texture_filter_anisotropic

GL_EXT_texture_lod_bias

GL_EXT_texture_mirror_clamp

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GL_KTX_buffer_region

GL_NV_blend_square

GL_NV_texgen_reflection

GL_SGIS_generate_mipmap

GL_SGIS_texture_edge_clamp

GL_SGIS_texture_lod

GL_WIN_swap_hint

WGL_EXT_swap_control



Code: Select all


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[duds26]

Used pre6 and have updated my ATI software also recently.
Guess this is the problem then.

[chris]

Hi Chris,

i tested a little more. My results under XPpro SP2@Ati x1950pro:
- 1.5.0pre4 and pre6 with Ati 7.12 works fine.
- 1.5.0pre4 and pre6 with Ati 8.1 produce the error under OpenGL 2.0 and OpenGL vertex program. Basic und Multitexture works fine!

I hope, this is helpfull.

Here some mor Informations:

Very helpful--thank you! Your testing has confirmed that the problem has something to do with point sprite support in ATI's latest driver.

--Chris

[dirkpitt]

I've been somewhat out of the loop, but apparently there have been multiple reports on the Mac recently too (Leopard 10.5) that the latest OS broke point sprites, so there's some independent confirmation there.

Could geometry shading provide the equivalent functionality of point sprites? I think what we're seeing here is video card vendors prioritizing driver development in favour of newer features - such as geometry shaders.

[chris]

I've been somewhat out of the loop, but apparently there have been multiple reports on the Mac recently too (Leopard 10.5) that the latest OS broke point sprites, so there's some independent confirmation there.

Could geometry shading provide the equivalent functionality of point sprites? I think what we're seeing here is video card vendors prioritizing driver development in favour of newer features - such as geometry shaders.

Geometry shaders certainly could be used instead of point sprites. The problem is that only very recent graphics cards--GeForce 8 and Radeon HD--support them.

--Chris

[dirkpitt]

Geometry shaders certainly could be used instead of point sprites. The problem is that only very recent graphics cards--GeForce 8 and Radeon HD--support them.

Fully-hardware accelerated support would require such cards, yes. But driver-level support is available even for the Radeon 9550 and better (at least in the Mac OS X 10.5.x drivers), as a hybrid cpu/gpu implementation. The Mac opengl devs claim that "it works very well" but I haven't upgraded to 10.5.x yet so I can't confirm this claim. Anybody have a free 10.5 DVD they're willing to donate?

[chris]

Geometry shaders certainly could be used instead of point sprites. The problem is that only very recent graphics cards--GeForce 8 and Radeon HD--support them.

Fully-hardware accelerated support would require such cards, yes. But driver-level support is available even for the Radeon 9550 and better (at least in the Mac OS X 10.5.x drivers), as a hybrid cpu/gpu implementation. The Mac opengl devs claim that "it works very well" but I haven't upgraded to 10.5.x yet so I can't confirm this claim.

This is very good news; I wasn't aware that geometry shaders were being emulated in the driver. It sounds like this is the solution for the point sprite troubles we've had with Mac/ATI. I might have some time over the next few days to play with geometry shaders on my GeForce 8800.

--Chris

[duds26]

Will this be in Celestia 1.5.1 ?

[Lian]

I hope so. I'm having the same problem with my ATI card. I miss the fuzzy points!

[CarstenDUS]

"june bug" - just updated my ATI driver (mobility radeon x1600, 8.453.0.0), same problem on 1.5.1 any news on this bug? I can live with the points for the time being though...

1.4.1 (incl. Vince Gian's patch) works fine.

[symaski62]

"june bug" - just updated my ATI driver (mobility radeon x1600, 8.453.0.0), same problem on 1.5.1 any news on this bug? I can live with the points for the time being though...

1.4.1 (incl. Vince Gian's patch) works fine.

http://ati.amd.com/support/driver.html

Update radeon x1600 version 8.5


not but

[CarstenDUS]

I wished I could - original ATI drivers won't install on my HP laptop, and 8.453.0.0 is the latest version HP offers I shouldn't have installed that HP-branded XP version in the first place.

But at least there's light at the end of the tunnel now (literally), thankx for the info!