Kepler's solar system model (work in progress)

[Cham]

I improved the Kepler model a bit. Now, each polyhedra has a different color, so we can see each of them more clearly. Also, the planetary orbits are clearly visible on each "orb track" :



For the artistic touch, I would like to engrave some citations from Kepler around the exterior side of the orbs. Any suggestions ? Andrea ?

[buggs_moran]

at Homer time the only passage to Ocean River was the Hercules Columns passage (Gibraltar), while in your model there is another wide passage left of Italy.
IMHO it could be like this:

Moreover, as shown in your second image, Africa looks with high mountains in the south, while I think that the knowledge of the African desert was not so good.
Perhaps only the Atlas Mountains, in Morocco, could be known because perhaps visible from the Mediterranean coast.
Anyhow, I suggest you to make a flatter Africa.

I adapted the map from here http://www.henry-davis.com/MAPS/Ancient ... /106D.html , that shows at the time perhaps knowledge of the seas west of Corsica were unknown and therefore open...



but I can change the model if totally necessary. I agree that they probably had knowledge of the whole Mediterranean Sea... I pulled the mountains from

[buggs_moran]

For the artistic touch, I would like to engrave some citations from Kepler around the exterior side of the orbs. Any suggestions ? Andrea ?

"geometrical things have provided the Creator with the model for decorating the whole world"

"Therefore, as matter strives for form, as a rough stone, of the correct size indeed strives for the Idea of the human form, so the geometrical proportions in the (solid) figures strive for harmonies; not so as to build and shape them, but because this matter fits more neatly to this form, this size of rock to this effigy, and also this proportion in a figure to this harmony, and therefore so that they may be built and shaped further, the matter in fact by its own form, the rock by the chisel into the appearance of an animate being, but the proportion of the spheres of the figures...by close and fitting harmony."

You might have to paraphrase...

Also, this page might help with names...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... 9-pl-3.jpg

[Cham]

Thanks Buggs,

according to that page from Kepler's book, the names he used for the planets are :

Mercuri(?)
Veneris
Telluris
Martis
Jovis
Saturni

That's interesting.

[Cham]

Thanks Buggs,

according to that page from Kepler's book, the names he used for the planets are :

Mercuri(?)
Veneris
Telluris
Martis
Jovis
Saturni

That's interesting.

[ANDREA]

Thanks Buggs, according to that page from Kepler's book, the names he used for the planets are :
Mercuri(?)
Veneris
Telluris
Martis
Jovis
Saturni
That's interesting.

Cham, it's correct but not in disagreement with my lecture, that was:
Sol
Mercurius
Venus
Terra
Luna
Mars
Jupiter
Saturnus
for the Planet names.
The names you found mean are the same I gave you, but declinated to mean:
Mercuri= "of" Mercurius
Veneris= "of" Venus and so on.
Only the Earth name differs, not only for the declination, because you found the other Latin name of the Earth, that was named both Terra and Tellus.
Using Terra the declinated name should be Terrae, as Luna should be Lunae.
The different naming is related to Telluri Orbis, or Mercuri Orbis, that mean The Earth Sphere, The Mercury Sphere, as you can see in the drawing at Buggs' link.
Hope to have been clear, otherwise I'll try to explain it better.
Bye

Andrea

[Cham]

Andrea,

so I suppose that naming the planets themselves in my addon, as Veneris, Telluris, and so on, would be a mistake ?

(and why is my previous message appears two times ? And I can't erase it, since the erase button doesn't appears at the upper-right part of the message. There seems to be a problem with the forum's server).

[ANDREA]

Andrea, so I suppose that naming the planets themselves in my addon, as Veneris, Telluris, and so on, would be a mistake ?

Yes Cham, it's wrong, the correct ones are those I gave you.
Just for your curiosity, take a minute to give a look on how names declination in Latin is complex and difficult (I know well this, as I studied Latin for 8 years in my elder age, many years ago).
Go here:
http://javierguerrero.netfirms.com/LATI ... TABLES.htm
There are 5 declinations, based on how the name ends, and three of them have further forking.
Terrible!
Bye

Andrea

[Cham]

Well then. But is there other designations, in Latin, for Venus, Mars and Jupiter ? I would prefer to give them an "original" name, while close to Kepler's original designations.

[ANDREA]

....at Homer time the only passage to Ocean River was the Hercules Columns passage (Gibraltar), while in your model there is another wide passage left of Italy.

I adapted the map from here ...., that shows at the time perhaps knowledge of the seas west of Corsica were unknown and therefore open...but I can change the model if totally necessary. I agree that they probably had knowledge of the whole Mediterranean Sea...

Chris, I know that image, but equally I know that, in his Odissey, Homer clearly says that the only known passage to the Ocean River is the Hercules Columns, so this means that they already knew the Spain.
This is the reason why I suggested to leave only that exit in the Mediterranesn Sea.

I pulled the mountains from
....

Yes, but as you see the mountains are only the Atlas chain in Morocco and (but at lower heights) in Algery, the remaining of North Africa is almost flat, no high mountains in Libya and Aegypt, as shown in that drawing.
Bye

Andrea

[ANDREA]

Well then. But is there other designations, in Latin, for Venus, Mars and Jupiter ? I would prefer to give them an "original" name, while close to Kepler's original designations.

My God, I must learn to write English in a hurry.
Cham, those names are absolutely correct.
If you want, I can find other Latin names for the planets, based on ancient Gods names, but they were not used just at Republic time, and surely not at Kepler's time.
Bye

Andrea

[Cham]

Andrea,

if possible, I prefer to use some names that would be used by Kepler, and not "Venus", "Mars", "Jupiter", just so the names aren't the same as the usual well known designation.

[ANDREA]

Andrea, if possible, I prefer to use some names that would be used by Kepler, and not "Venus", "Mars", "Jupiter", just so the names aren't the same as the usual well known designation.

Cham, Kepler was writing in Latin, and he could only name the planets as I suggested, nothing else, sorry.
But for your satisfaction, here are the original Greek Gods that originated the Latin names of the planets:
Greek Name --Transliteration-- Latin Spelling --Translation

Fainwn -- Phain??n --Phaenon -- Shining One, Planet Saturn
Faeqwn --Phaeth??n -- Phaethon --Blazing One, Planet Jupiter
PuroeiV -- Pyroeis --Pyroeis --Fiery One, Planet Mars
Stilbwn -- Stilb??n --Stilbon -- Shining One, Planet Mercury
EwsforoV -- E??sphoros-- Eosphorus --Dawn-Bringer, Planet Venus or
EsperoV -- Hesperos -- Hesperus -- Evening Star, Planet Venus

I doubt that these can help you.
Bye

Andrea

[Cham]

Thanks Andrea.

I'll stick with the standard Latin names, then.

[ANDREA]

Thanks Andrea. I'll stick with the standard Latin names, then.

You are very welcome, Cham.
Bye

Andrea

[Cham]

Well, I now believe my model is finished and ready for a release. I need to play a bit more with it, just to be sure. Here are three previews (click to enlarge the pictures, as usual). Critics and comments are welcome, before I release it.

[buggs_moran]

Looks fantastic Cham. I need to figure out how to make my spheres nice and smooth like yours...

Greek Name --Transliteration-- Latin Spelling --Translation

Fainwn -- Phain??n --Phaenon -- Shining One, Planet Saturn
Faeqwn --Phaeth??n -- Phaethon --Blazing One, Planet Jupiter
PuroeiV -- Pyroeis --Pyroeis --Fiery One, Planet Mars
Stilbwn -- Stilb??n --Stilbon -- Shining One, Planet Mercury
EwsforoV -- E??sphoros-- Eosphorus --Dawn-Bringer, Planet Venus or
EsperoV -- Hesperos -- Hesperus -- Evening Star, Planet Venus

I doubt that these can help you.
Bye

Andrea

The Greek might be good for the Homeric system...

[Fenerit]

Andrea,

if possible, I prefer to use some names that would be used by Kepler, and not "Venus", "Mars", "Jupiter", just so the names aren't the same as the usual well known designation.

Cham, for the names look here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Ptol ... -small.png

this image is of about '500

EDIT LATER:

I don't see ALL your images concerning India, Kepler, and accretion!

[Cham]

Thanks Fenerit,

Andrea, what do you think of these names ?

[ANDREA]

Thanks Fenerit, Andrea, what do you think of these names ?

Cham, probably Fenerit didn't read my previous messages, because now we are speaking of the same thing I told here:

Cham, it's correct but not in disagreement with my lecture, that was:
Sol - Mercurius - Venus - Terra - Luna - Mars - Jupiter - Saturnus
for the Planet names.
The names you found mean the same I gave you, but declinated to mean:
Mercuri= "of" Mercurius
Veneris= "of" Venus and so on.
Only the Earth name differs, not only for the declination, because you found the other Latin name of the Earth, that was named both Terra and Tellus.
Using Terra the declinated name should be Terrae, as Luna should be Lunae.
The different naming is related to Telluri Orbis, or Mercuri Orbis, that mean The Earth Sphere, The Mercury Sphere, as you can see in the drawing at Buggs' link.

In Kepler's drawing, the latin names are:
(Coelum) Saturnis
(Coelum) Iovis
(Coelum) Martis
etc, that mean
the Sky of Saturn, the Sky of Jupiter, the Sky of Mars, and so on.
So, if in your model you wish to write this way, it's correct to write
(Coelum) Saturnis, but if you want to write the planet's name Saturn, you must write Saturnus.
Hope to have been clear.
Bye

Andrea