Celestia Forums

This only proves that certain people shouldn't breed....

Besides, I doubt she has any moral problems at all. Clearly, she wants only money out of the whole thing.

...John...

Dollan wrote:Besides, I doubt she has any moral problems at all. Clearly, she wants only money out of the whole thing.

Not necessarily from the lawsuit though - the publicity is probably worth much more than the bills for the lawyers. So IMHO publicity stunts like this should simply be ignored.

But then again maybe she really believes it, which would be simply sad

Harald

EDIT: fixed typo

Dear oh dear, chaos syndrome, you should not allow the stupidity of a select few people such as Marina Bai to cause you to lose faith in [all of?] humanity .

The space.com news article (http://www.space.com/news/ap_050705_dee ... loger.html) is almost identical to the news.yahoo.com news article (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050705/ap_ ... comet_case) and both are nth hand. In any case, I'm struggling to find an original web-based report from Izvestia on this (the 'English' site remains in Russian), but Auntie beeb did have this the day before with more details anyhow: Russian sues Nasa for comet upset (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4649987.stm).

Harry wrote:publicity stungs like this should simply be ignored.

Actually, I quite like it when this sort of thing happens. It should not be ignored, it should be challenged. It's a great opportunity to point out why the claims are wrong, and a country so full of superstitious people like Russia (sorry, but it's true!) might benefit. We do have a Russian Celestian here, don't we? Care to comment, sir?

The case has only been filed. NASA ignored the hearing of such a meritless case, but Russian law requires the case to be heard nevertheless. I don't undrstand the jurisdiction, but NASA should turn up, it should be easy to deal with. For example, the claim: "Nobody has yet proven that this experiment was safe," says Ms Bay's lawyer Alexander Molokhov. I think it's just been demonstrated that it was safe. It's a matter of highlighting the need for burden of proof on her. Some questions I'd like to be asked:

1. Did this 'professional' astrologer fail to foresee the events she describes?
2. How does she equate her experiencing 'a moral trauma' to $300 million?
3. Is she making a packet recharging all her clients for having to recompute their horoscopes through no fault of her own?
4. What calculations and observations can she present showing a change in the comet's orbit, and it's chances of colliding with Earth before and after impact?
5. Can she do the same for the claim (repeated by her laywer, Mr. Molokhov*) that the comet's magnetic field changed?
6. Would she also claim that if the comet had orginally been on a collision course with Earth, that no one should be allowed to alter its course lest the forces of nature became unbalanced or her horoscopes would get mucked up? Otherwise, would she claim it meritless to test a comet's resilience to impact if she did agree such comets should be diverted?
7. Which emperor/monarch shall be dying due to the apparition of this comet?

* From the Beeb article:"The impact changed the magnetic properties of the comet, and this could have affected mobile telephony here on Earth. If your phone went down this morning, ask yourself Why? and then get in touch with us," says Mr Molokhov.

So, there you are then.

Spiff.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:people like Russia (sorry, but it's true!) might benefit. We do have a Russian Celestian here, don't we? Care to comment, sir?

....

Spiff.

We actually got THOUSANDS, but they are not able and certainly NOT interested to the express their opinions in this context .

In clear text, I am quite sure that among the huge amount of 'bots' that have logged into this site, the Russian ones are leading by far...

Bye Fridger

Hang on, for real Russians, there might be Eveningwind. Lemme just ask...

Spiff.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

Harry wrote:publicity stunts like this should simply be ignored.

Actually, I quite like it when this sort of thing happens. It should not be ignored, it should be challenged. It's a great opportunity to point out why the claims are wrong, and a country so full of superstitious people like Russia (sorry, but it's true!) might benefit.

Unfortunately in most news publications there won't be any serious discussion why this is complete BS. So unless you actually have a chance to discuss why this is utter nonsense, we should pay the attention it deserves: none. But of course news publications like these stories, so they will publish it without scientific background.
Now if you get a chance to discuss Astrology or other nonsense in private, with someone who may actually listen to you, then it's certainly a good idea (though hard to do without getting mad). If you'd get the chance to discuss this in public and have a chance that people listen to you, it would be even better.

Harald

Harry wrote:So unless you actually have a chance to discuss why this is utter nonsense, ...

We need to make the chance. I understand your despair, but the Russian law means the case has to be heard regardless of merit. Sometimes, we have to play the game. Or are you happy with 'Intelligent Design' in US schools*?

Anyway, Capricorns like me like a good argument!

Spiff.

* While you're ignoring it: Coming to a country near you soon: the UK. Would you Adam and Eve it? (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4398345.stm).

Spaceman Spiff wrote:We need to make the chance. I understand your despair, but the Russian law means the case has to be heard regardless of merit. Sometimes, we have to play the game.

That's just the point here: we don't have to play the game, we even can't play the game. Let's assume that this is a publicity stunt: the astrologer automatically wins as soon as the story gets widely reported (which has happened, so it's too late). Even if the court would laugh at her claims - she got all the attention she wanted, all over the world. We won't find articles like the one on Bad Astronomy in the newspaper. So let's leave this to NASA's lawyers, and concentrate on people we can teach something about astronomy, and why astrology is nonsense.

Or are you happy with 'Intelligent Design' in US schools*?

* While you're ignoring it: Coming to a country near you soon: the UK.

That's sad.
But you are misunderstanding me if you think we should generally ignore stuff like that. If you can do something about it, then do it! But that lawsuit simply isn't newsworthy, and shouldn't have been reported in the first place. Reporting it may just be what the astrologer wanted.

The following link provides clear and irrefutable proof that the Universe was created by The Flying Spaghetti Monster. Flying Spaghetti Monsterism is clearly the way forward for all righteous pilgrims, and those who say otherwise should beware of His Noodly Appendage.

Arrr, matey!

http://www.venganza.org/

Harry wrote:So let's leave this to NASA's lawyers, and concentrate on people we can teach something about astronomy, and why astrology is nonsense.

Hmm, yes Harry, I do see your view better now. If the matter had not made the press, ignoring it would have been best. Since it's public now, I think NASA had better take this up and defeat it good. I also would be pleased if the Russian court was seen to dismiss astrology and Bai's other claims as without merit.

lostfisherman wrote:The following link provides clear and irrefutable proof that the Universe was created by The Flying Spaghetti Monster.

Excellent! And I'm saved too! Thank you, thank you!

Spiff.

P.s., useful remark in Evolution-Creation debates: "If you creationists want equal time, you can have the six days, and we'll have the 4?? billion years."