Celestia Forums

I would like to know how to edit Cloud Shadows in solarsys.ssc.
Is it necesary to put the extra Raleigh effects in the altsurface?
Other thing.I don??t know how to edit this in solarsys.ssc,since everytime I tried,the Wordpad said that the file will be saved in the text format and when this happen,Celestia no longer USE it.
I now that??s maybe be a noon question,but I am insecure about this...
I know that is a option of automatically putting cloud shadows,but the shadows are exaggerated and don??t follow the cloud format.

danielj wrote:I would like to know how to edit Cloud Shadows in solarsys.ssc.
Is it necesary to put the extra Raleigh effects in the altsurface?

Sorry, I got no idea what you are asking for here. Could you be more clear?

danielj wrote:Other thing.I don??t know how to edit this in solarsys.ssc,since everytime I tried,the Wordpad said that the file will be saved in the text format and when this happen,Celestia no longer USE it.

Try using Notepad instead. Right click on the file and copy the file, right click on an empty area inside the folder and paste the file, (now you should have a file that is named Copy of ......), open that file with Notepad, Make the changes and hit save, not save as. Then you could rename it. You should now have the original and the edited copy. Try using the file in Celestia. If it doesn't work or does something that you don't want, delete it and start over.

danielj wrote:I now that??s maybe be a noon question,but I am insecure about this...
I know that is a option of automatically putting cloud shadows,but the shadows are exaggerated and don??t follow the cloud format.

Again, I'm not sure what you mean. But I think you can try to play with the CloudHeight parameter. Change it lower or higher. That may be what you are trying to do?

cartrite

It??s RaiLEIGH effects.I was reffering to this type of thing:
Mie 0.001
MieAsymmetry -0.15
Rayleigh [ 0.001 0.0025 0.006 ]
Absorption [ 0 0 0 ]
MieScaleHeight 12


In the following topic,it learns how to create a Cloud Shadow,but only in Celestia 1.4.1 or before:
http://www.celestiaproject.net/forum/viewtopic ... ud+shadows

cartrite wrote:

danielj wrote:I would like to know how to edit Cloud Shadows in solarsys.ssc.
Is it necesary to put the extra Raleigh effects in the altsurface?

Sorry, I got no idea what you are asking for here. Could you be more clear?

[

danielj wrote:

It??s RaiLEIGH effects.I was reffering to this type of thing:
Mie 0.001
MieAsymmetry -0.15
Rayleigh [ 0.001 0.0025 0.006 ]
Absorption [ 0 0 0 ]
MieScaleHeight 12

This has nothing to do with cloud shadows. It controls how the atmoshere gets rendered with OGL2.

danielj wrote:

In the following topic,it learns how to create a Cloud Shadow,but only in Celestia 1.4.1 or before:

That thread has nothing to do with working cloud shadows in 1.5.0. That thread refers to a workaround for 1.4.1 to get cloudshadows before that enhancement was added. To turn on cloud shadows in 1.5.0 cvs there is an option in the render menu.

Cloud shadows in v1.5 can only be turned off and on, not edited. They're generated in the OpenGL 2.0 render path from whatever CloudMap is currently being used. They aren't a separate Overlay texture as they had to be in previous versions of Celestia. That texture had to be created by someone for a matching CloudMap, but was visible in all render paths. You can still use those Overlay textures, but they'll look strange if both types of shadows are visible.

You can make the OGL2 shadows more obvious if you raise the height of the cloud layer with an SSC like this:

A picture speaks a thousand words.



cartrite

Hum,I tried to play with Cloud Height.I put from 5 to 60.NOTHING HAPPENS.
I disable the cloud shadows and put a overlay cloud shadow,using the pseudo shadows code.Well,the spots have vanished,but the overlay don??t appear to be working since it??s very difficult to see any difference from only the texture applied.Maybe since my cloud texture is 8k,I should put a 8k Cloud Shadow map,too.But if it??s not this,so overlay texture is not working,yet,in Celestia 1.5.0 pre1...
Or maybe the cloud shadows enabled by menu only matches the 1k custom cloud map.
I am using a 8k Cloud map from Don Edwards,one that have swirls.
I will post the pictures showing the problem later.Now,I am not at home...

cartrite wrote:

danielj wrote:I would like to know how to edit Cloud Shadows in solarsys.ssc.
Is it necesary to put the extra Raleigh effects in the altsurface?

Sorry, I got no idea what you are asking for here. Could you be more clear?

danielj wrote:Other thing.I don??t know how to edit this in solarsys.ssc,since everytime I tried,the Wordpad said that the file will be saved in the text format and when this happen,Celestia no longer USE it.

Try using Notepad instead. Right click on the file and copy the file, right click on an empty area inside the folder and paste the file, (now you should have a file that is named Copy of ......), open that file with Notepad, Make the changes and hit save, not save as. Then you could rename it. You should now have the original and the edited copy. Try using the file in Celestia. If it doesn't work or does something that you don't want, delete it and start over.

danielj wrote:I now that??s maybe be a noon question,but I am insecure about this...
I know that is a option of automatically putting cloud shadows,but the shadows are exaggerated and don??t follow the cloud format.

Again, I'm not sure what you mean. But I think you can try to play with the CloudHeight parameter. Change it lower or higher. That may be what you are trying to do?

cartrite

danielj,
Look at Help=>OpenGL Info. If your max texture size is 4k, then your cloudmap's size can only be up to 4k for the cloudshadows to work properly.

But how some people are showing the 8k Cloud Shadow Map in action,if NO AVAILABLE video card has a texture size bigger than 4k(for meshes,clouds and rings)?I understood that what limited the size was cloud rotation.If I put the speed to 0,I could use any size of cloud shadow I want.But if it??s not this,why someone bother to create 8k or even 16k Cloud Shadow Map?
Only future DX10 video cards will display 8k textures:
http://www.neowin.net/index.php?act=view&id=33827

cartrite wrote:danielj,
Look at Help=>OpenGL Info. If your max texture size is 4k, then your cloudmap's size can only be up to 4k for the cloudshadows to work properly.

danielj wrote:But how some people are showing the 8k Cloud Shadow Map in action,if NO AVAILABLE video card has a texture size bigger than 4k(for meshes,clouds and rings)?I understood that what limited the size was cloud rotation.If I put the speed to 0,I could use any size of cloud shadow I want.But if it??s not this,why someone bother to create 8k or even 16k Cloud Shadow Map?

This a wrong assumption as far as 1.5.0-pre/cvs is concerned. There is no cloud shadow map for cloud shadows to work via the render option shown in the screenshot I showed in my previous post.

http://www.celestiaproject.net/forum/viewtopic ... 9023#79023

Cloud shadows are drawn by information supplied by the CLOUDMAP using OGL2 in 1.5.0-pre/cvs. The cloud shadows maps used in the past for 1.4.1 have nothing to do with cloud shadows that are drawn by 1.5.0-pre/cvs. Cloud shadow maps for 1.4.1 should work for you if you don't make any mistakes. Once you get them working in 1.4.1, they should also work in 1.5.0-cvs. You will probally need to turn the cloud shadow option off in the render menu though. Especially if your maps are bigger than your max texture size. As long as your NOT trying to render cloudshadows with the menu option on, your cloudmaps can be larger than your texture limit.

In order to draw cloud shadows correctly in 1.5.0/cvs using the cloudshadow code(menu option on), the cloudmap can only be as large as your graphic's card texture buffer. This is shown in Help => Open GL Info. max texture size =.

danielj,

Maybe since my cloud texture is 8k,I should put a 8k Cloud Shadow map,too

That would be a good start.

However, the cloudmap that was available at the motherlode was under the heading of Northern Summer but a file name = clouds-121303-8k.dds is there. In Don's instructions, he stated that the Northern Summer-Southern Winter cloudmap at 8k or 4k was needed to get the shadows to work properly. I'm not sure that it's the right cloudmap (clouds-121303-8k.dds) to use to get the full effect. The Northern Summer-Southern Winter cloudmap may be different somehow that displays the shadows better. You'll have to ask him.

When you are using Don's CloudShadowMap try turning clouds off. You should see the shadows all over. This will show you that they are there. Some of the BMNG textures have very dark oceans If you are using one as your earth texture, you may not be noticing the cloud shadows with the clouds on because they are drowned out by the dark texture.

good luck.

The result is not that impressive,compared to the imagens in the this topic
rehttp://celestiaproject.net/forum/viewtopic.p ... sc&start=0

,but I found the exact configurations to the cloud shadows to work:

CloudHeight 12
CloudMap "clouds-121303-8k.dds"

cartrite wrote:danielj,

Maybe since my cloud texture is 8k,I should put a 8k Cloud Shadow map,too

That would be a good start.

However, the cloudmap that was available at the motherlode was under the heading of Northern Summer but a file name = clouds-121303-8k.dds is there. In Don's instructions, he stated that the Northern Summer-Southern Winter cloudmap at 8k or 4k was needed to get the shadows to work properly. I'm not sure that it's the right cloudmap (clouds-121303-8k.dds) to use to get the full effect. The Northern Summer-Southern Winter cloudmap may be different somehow that displays the shadows better. You'll have to ask him.

When you are using Don's CloudShadowMap try turning clouds off. You should see the shadows all over. This will show you that they are there. Some of the BMNG textures have very dark oceans If you are using one as your earth texture, you may not be noticing the cloud shadows with the clouds on because they are drowned out by the dark texture.

good luck.

Let??s get it more clear.Even with the cloud shadows on,I can??t see the 3d like effect shown in the pictures of this topics below.Do you have any idea why this happen?

danielj wrote:The result is not that impressive,compared to the imagens in the this topic
rehttp://celestiaproject.net/forum/viewtopic.p ... sc&start=0

,but I found the exact configurations to the cloud shadows to work:

CloudHeight 12
CloudMap "clouds-121303-8k.dds"

cartrite wrote:danielj,

Maybe since my cloud texture is 8k,I should put a 8k Cloud Shadow map,too

That would be a good start.

However, the cloudmap that was available at the motherlode was under the heading of Northern Summer but a file name = clouds-121303-8k.dds is there. In Don's instructions, he stated that the Northern Summer-Southern Winter cloudmap at 8k or 4k was needed to get the shadows to work properly. I'm not sure that it's the right cloudmap (clouds-121303-8k.dds) to use to get the full effect. The Northern Summer-Southern Winter cloudmap may be different somehow that displays the shadows better. You'll have to ask him.

When you are using Don's CloudShadowMap try turning clouds off. You should see the shadows all over. This will show you that they are there. Some of the BMNG textures have very dark oceans If you are using one as your earth texture, you may not be noticing the cloud shadows with the clouds on because they are drowned out by the dark texture.

good luck.

The first being that you will have to use either my new Northern Summer-Southern Winter cloudmap at 8k or 4k.

Are you using that cloudmap?

danielj,

Let me step in here and try and help out. First off, if you want the cloud shadows and the clouds to match up right you have to use the matching set. If you don't use the matching set you will have shadows where you don't want them as my cloudmaps have evoloved over time and no two are exactly alike. The second thing is that if you using the 1.4.x builds of Celestia you have to enter the information into your SSC file right or it won't work. Now if you have the shadows working, to get more depth or more of a 3D look you need to raise the clouds. Go into the SSC file and set the cloud height to 11 or 12. This should make things look a little more like the pictures I posted.

I haven't played around much with the setting in the CVS builds as of yet but what ever the clouds height settings are just try raising them to see if this gives you the look you are going for.

One more thing, you don't have to use the 8k cloud shadow exclusivly with the 8k cloudmap. You can use the 4k if this is stretching you video cards memory a bit. This will make the shadows edges a bit more fuzzy than using the 8k, but the effect is still quite good. Just make sure that you are using a matched named set of cloud textures and shadows.

I hope this helps.


Don. Edwards

I will try in Celestia 1.4.1.It didn??t work in Celestia 1.5.0 pre 1.I raised the clouds to 12 km and nothing happened,no improvement at all.
Other thing:only the texture "clouds-121303-4k.dds" or "clouds-121303-8k.dds" matches the cloud shadows.The Northern Summer...don??t quite match.Do you have any idea what cause this difference?

Don. Edwards wrote:danielj,

Let me step in here and try and help out. First off, if you want the cloud shadows and the clouds to match up right you have to use the matching set. If you don't use the matching set you will have shadows where you don't want them as my cloudmaps have evoloved over time and no two are exactly alike. The second thing is that if you using the 1.4.x builds of Celestia you have to enter the information into your SSC file right or it won't work. Now if you have the shadows working, to get more depth or more of a 3D look you need to raise the clouds. Go into the SSC file and set the cloud height to 11 or 12. This should make things look a little more like the pictures I posted.

I haven't played around much with the setting in the CVS builds as of yet but what ever the clouds height settings are just try raising them to see if this gives you the look you are going for.

One more thing, you don't have to use the 8k cloud shadow exclusivly with the 8k cloudmap. You can use the 4k if this is stretching you video cards memory a bit. This will make the shadows edges a bit more fuzzy than using the 8k, but the effect is still quite good. Just make sure that you are using a matched named set of cloud textures and shadows.

I hope this helps.


Don. Edwards

Of course I know why. As I said no two of my cloudmaps are the same. You have to use a matched set. The two cloudmaps you mentioned are not the same. one is older and I moved things around. So of course it isn't going to match up with the newer ones. If you need links to matching cloudmaps and shadows I can give them to you.

Don. Edwards

Please,give me some links.I really would like to see the 3d like effect.
As I mentioned,I put the height of the clouds to 12 km and nothing happened.
Also,the 4k Cloud Map don??t work in Celestia 1.5.0 pre 1,specially when I try to match the 4k Cloud Shadow Map.I have no idea why...

Don. Edwards wrote:Of course I know why. As I said no two of my cloudmaps are the same. You have to use a matched set. The two cloudmaps you mentioned are not the same. one is older and I moved things around. So of course it isn't going to match up with the newer ones. If you need links to matching cloudmaps and shadows I can give them to you.

Don. Edwards