Feature Request: "Attract Mode"

[Size_Mick]

Basically, it's like this: I just would like to be able to start Celestia and have it automatically enter something akin to the "attract mode" on an arcade machine. The easiest way I can think of is just to have it automatically run scripts in a random order. The other way I can think of is to have it programmed to randomly jump around from object to object in a "demo mode" like Ssystem/OpenUniverse did. Either way, the point would be to completely remove any necessary user interaction to have something interesting come up; so I could just sit there and, no pun intended, space out on it :)

This is of course the whole reason I was going on about looping demos earlier. But I really would like to have a Celestia just randomly run scripts for me and save me the hassle.

You could even make a screensaver plugin for it after that :o

[maxim]

Isn't that already possible with celx-scripts?
Can one use a celx-script as startup script?

maxim

[t00fri]

after all this painful work that went into achieving arcsec orbit accuracy, it was always my "dream" that Celestia would end up as a screensaver;-)

Bye Fridger

[Harry]

Isn't that already possible with celx-scripts?

Yes, but apparently asking for a change to Celestia is a lot easier than to write a script.

Can one use a celx-script as startup script?

Works nicely. Just replace start.cel by the name of a CELX-script in celestia.cfg.

Harald

[maxim]

BTW, this brings me to another topic:

I've been questioned shortly if it is possible to use celestia for vj-ing (yes, another missuse of hard derived accuracy fridger ). Well it would I think, because you can start single sequences as cel-scripts from within a celx-script. But what you can't do by now is interrupting or replacing a running cel-script from within another script. Currently two scripts will overlap I suppose. Is it an idea (and is there a simple way) to change this?

maxim

[Harry]

Well it would I think, because you can start single sequences as cel-scripts from within a celx-script. But what you can't do by now is interrupting or replacing a running cel-script from within another script. Currently two scripts will overlap I suppose. Is it an idea (and is there a simple way) to change this?

Not sure what you mean - the CELX script can stop executing the CEL script and start executing another one at any time. You can even "multi-task" two or more CEL-scripts, i.e. execute one step of each script per tick - but this doesn't make sense, it's just technical possible.

Harald

[maxim]

- but this doesn't make sense, it's just technical possible.Harald

For a vj it would - because he is acting life with several streams that he changes and fades at free will, according to the music.

maxim

[Harry]

- but this doesn't make sense, it's just technical possible.Harald

For a vj it would - because he is acting life with several streams that he changes and fades at free will, according to the music.

You need to keep in mind that a goto-command is still just a single command. Once started it will continue, until interrupted either by another goto or a cancelgoto. So you can - technically - switch between two CEL-script during a goto, but the result will be disappointing. Switching the scripts doesn't switch the state Celestia is in, and one script will continue where the other one was interrupted. All you get is a completely chaotic sequence of gotos etc. and text on the screen.

Harald

[Guest]

Ok, I see.
So what would be neccecary would be a saveState() and a restoreState() command.
That sounds quite less trivial. Seems that this has to be part of celestia core.

maxim

[maxim]

Sorry. Was me.

maxim

[Size_Mick]

after all this painful work that went into achieving arcsec orbit accuracy, it was always my "dream" that Celestia would end up as a screensaver;-)

LOL Well I hope it's not too degrading that I should ask, only I don't think this idea of mine lacks merit. Let's face it, it would be pretty cool if Celestia could just be put on "auto-pilot" and just randomly run scripts in a folder (of course you could run them in sequence too -- I know that this can be done now, but not without modifying the scripts).

The whole URL script thing just blew me away, and it makes it incredi-easy to show people stuff just by emailing them. This is just another way that I think would make Celestia more accessible to the general public, who would get instant gratification upon launch. Of course it would (hopefully) be a feature that is toggleable in options somewhere.

[Harry]

Let's face it, it would be pretty cool if Celestia could just be put on "auto-pilot" and just randomly run scripts in a folder (of course you could run them in sequence too -- I know that this can be done now, but not without modifying the scripts).

So, you say it's better to modify Celestia than to do some trivial(!) modifications to a few scripts?

... This is just another way that I think would make Celestia more accessible to the general public, who would get instant gratification upon launch.

A more complex start-script should suffice.

What would be great for new users would be a more interactive demo-script, something more interactively to explain how to use Celestia. Unfortunately that would be a lot of work, but it may be worth it.

Harald

[Size_Mick]

So, you say it's better to modify Celestia than to do some trivial(!) modifications to a few scripts?

Yes, I do in fact. As far as the programming goes, considering the other features of Celestia, I would bet money that this is as trivial a code change as it could get. I don't see why you are all so intent on blasting this idea. I haven't seen any criticisms that make it sound like a bad idea; just excuses as to why it should be done some other way, all suggestions which PLACE THE BURDEN ON THE USER.

All that needs to be done is have Celestia recognize the scripts folder, run one at random, wait for it to terminate, and run another. And so it would continue to do so until the user moved the mouse or hit a key.

P.S. As far as script changing goes, it can't be much more trivial than coding, considering the surprisingly small number of scripts available for download.

[selden]

Mick,

The reluctance to add it to Celestia's code is that there are only a few people who have the knowledge and who are permitted to do that, and they're busy adding other features.

In contrast, anyone can write the script to do it.
Even you.
And then it can be provided for all to use.

[Harry]

As far as the programming goes, considering the other features of Celestia, I would bet money that this is as trivial a code change as it could get.

Compared to other features that may be true, but it's still some work.

I don't see why you are all so intent on blasting this idea. I haven't seen any criticisms that make it sound like a bad idea; just excuses as to why it should be done some other way, all suggestions which PLACE THE BURDEN ON THE USER.

It's not a bad idea, it's just not necessary. You want an attract mode? You can have it, right now, simply by writing a nice start-script. But all YOU do is complain, and telling us what YOU want.

P.S. As far as script changing goes, it can't be much more trivial than coding, considering the surprisingly small number of scripts available for download.

What kind of proof is that?

Harald

[Bob Hegwood]

P.S. As far as script changing goes, it can't be much more trivial than coding, considering the surprisingly small number of scripts available for download.

Mr. Mick...

Perhaps you're just not finding the scripts. So far, I have about 40 of them
in use with my version of Celestia. Have you looked at the MotherLode?
Don Goyette's site? Maxim's? Mine?

Plenty of scripts for all, both CEL and CELX. CEL scripts are easier for us
Brain-Dead types, but with a little effort, even those complicated LUA
scripts can be understood and created by almost anyone with the desire.

Just thought I'd mention it.

Take care, Bob

[Slalomsk8er]

Please read The Feature Requests Collecting Thread and ADD not yet requested features (one per post) and link to this Topic!!!

Else i fear the ideas go lost with time!!!

Thanks, Dominik

[Size_Mick]

What kind of proof is that?

Proof that it's difficult to write scripts, and further proof can be found on this very board in the scripts forum. I am not complaining about anything but the some of the replies to this thread being somewhat negative on such a simple idea. I understand that other features are being worked on and it might take a long time for coders to get around to a change like this, but thus far all I have seen from you is criticism because there is another way to do it. Unfortunately that way is more difficult for the end user -- you have to wind up with duplicate copies of the scripts, the original and the one modified to be put in a loop. Also if you want this sort of feature in the first place, you have to get into scripting, which as I've stated already is not an easy task, especially for people that don't type well or are not computer-oriented enough. I mean heck, look at the default Celestia demo and you can see by the number of bugs in it that tinkering with scripts isn't exactly user-friendly.

I don't care that it's not important enough to be priority. I'm not worried about how long it takes for the devs to get around to it. I know there are other more important features that people want to see, and I expect them to focus on those. I'm certainly not in a big hurry. But that argument in itself is not a reason to shoot this idea down so quickly. For now, the script looping thing is an alternative for people who are comfortable with script changing, but that doesn't make it the best idea by any means.

[Harry]

What kind of proof is that?

Proof that it's difficult to write scripts, and further proof can be found on this very board in the scripts forum.

You were comparing script changing with writing...

I am not complaining about anything but the some of the replies to this thread being somewhat negative on such a simple idea.

Not necessarily on the idea (except for Fridger, who likes things to be more scientific B) ), but more on the fact that you refuse to try this idea with what's already available. If you think it's a good idea, than do something with it, combine a few scripts, write a new one, etc.

I understand that other features are being worked on and it might take a long time for coders to get around to a change like this, but thus far all I have seen from you is criticism because there is another way to do it. Unfortunately that way is more difficult for the end user

If this turns out to be an important feature and that these difficulties are a real problem, than we can still think again about implementing it.

-- you have to wind up with duplicate copies of the scripts, the original and the one modified to be put in a loop.

If you embed a CEL-script in a CELX-script you shouldn't have to modify it at all, just copy & paste. The CELX-script could even read the CEL-script from disk, completely unmodified, it just has to know the name (unfortunately the Lua-IO-libs don't allow listing directories - how stupid is that...) and get the permission to do that.

Also if you want this sort of feature in the first place, you have to get into scripting, which as I've stated already is not an easy task, especially for people that don't type well or are not computer-oriented enough.

OK, then why don't you create such an "attraction-mode" script, and publish it for everybody to enjoy?

I mean heck, look at the default Celestia demo and you can see by the number of bugs in it that tinkering with scripts isn't exactly user-friendly.

Not sure which bugs you are referring to, but the script is old and unmaintained, so there may be incompatibilites with recent versions of Celestia (e.g. the script may not handle newer features correctly).

As I already wrote, IMHO it would be nice to have an updated demo script, but apparently nobody wants to do the work.

Harald